Ep. 83 - Fredy Mendez From Sunwave, A Marine Veteran Explains How Data Can Prevent Relapse

We talk with Marine veteran Freddie Mendez about why veteran mental health care breaks down after treatment and how better behavioral health software can give clinicians time back to actually listen. We dig into outcomes data, privacy, and aftercare systems that spot relapse risk early without turning veterans into numbers. 
• Freddie’s Marine background and what he learned overseas about culture and hard choices 
• The “void” of transition and why adrenaline chasing can slide into addiction 
• Why he walked away from pharma and toward behavioral health and addiction recovery work 
• How Sunwave aims to cut clinician charting time and reduce burnout 
• Outcomes measurement for PTSD, addiction, and depression using structured data points 
• Alumni aftercare check-ins that trigger early outreach before relapse 
• Data security concerns and avoiding third-party PHI leakage 
• Partnering with nonprofits through conversations about pain points and workflows 
• Why listening and cultural competence matter more than perfect scripts 
My email is Freddie at sunwavehealth.com.

Like, Subscribe and Share. If you have comments or suggestions email us at: vetsconnectionpodcast@gmail.com. You can also find the video of this podcast on our YouTube Channel - Vetsconnection Podcast

Transcript

Welcome And Freddie’s Role

Scott McLean 0:00

Welcome to the podcast. I'm Scott McLean. My guest today is Freddie Mendez. Freddie is the, I want to get this right, director of veteran programs and account executive for Sunwave. Now, as you know, I'm not going to try to try to describe what he does. I'm going to let Freddie do that. What's going on, Scott? How are you doing, my friend?

Fredy Mendez 0:21

I'm doing great. Thank you so much for the opportunity to come here and thank you to your audience that are uh willing to listen.

Scott McLean 0:27

Yeah, yeah. Well, that they are who I need. They are the engine that makes this machine run. Before we get into what you do, well, tell us what you do first. What what uh what is your position at Sunwave? What is what do we do?

Speaker 0:40

Yeah, so my position at Sunwave is, as you mentioned, uh director of veteran programs, and I'm also the account executive there. And uh a little of what I do to simplify it, I like to help people. All right. Sunwave is is a software company uh that enables or equips clinicians and executives or facility owners with the software they need to do two things. Number one, amplify the outreach of helping people with dealing with drug addiction or behavior health issues. And number two, using that same software to make sure that we're reducing burnout rate while making sure that the clinicians have more patient-facing encounters rather than behind the laptop.

Scott McLean 1:22

All right. And I want to get into more of that, but uh, you're a veteran? Yes, sir. Uh, I know. What what branch? The Marines. There you go. Hoorah. I can't get away from you people.

Speaker 1:35

It's okay. You don't have to. We just follow.

Scott McLean 1:37

I say this every week. I'm like, yeah, I get all these guests that come on, and you know, every once in a while in a blue moon, I get an Air Force person. Yeah. It's always the Marines.

Speaker 1:47

Yeah. It's probably because you probably have some crayons laying around that keep on getting detected to. The red ones are my favorite flavor, by the way.

Scott McLean 1:56

You got it, buddy. There's a box waiting for you outside the door. That's your going away gift.

Speaker 1 2:02

Thanks, man.

Scott McLean 2:03

So when did you go in? So I went in in 2011. 2011? Okay. Yeah.

Marine Service And Deployments

Scott McLean 2:10

And uh where were you uh were you deployed?

Speaker 2:13

Yeah, I was deployed twice. Uh the first one was to uh Europe, specifically in Romania and Mikael Kuklicano, and we were just a quick reaction force there. And then the second one was for JHSV one, I probably butchered that, and that was all throughout Central America. So for those that don't know where Central America is, most of us sometimes don't know where to point in the map. It's uh Belize, Guatemala, Honduras, and that's where we touch space at.

Scott McLean 2:42

There's people I'm not lying, there's people that think New Mexico is part of Mexico.

Speaker 1 2:48

Oh, yeah. Maybe at one point, but now not the Central America. We know not the Central America, yeah.

Scott McLean 2:53

I was just saying it geography really isn't my strong point. Yeah, but I did know that New Mexico is in the United States and Central America is basically where it is. Absolutely. Um so you were in for how long?

Speaker 3:08

I was in there for about six years, I would say. Six six-ish. What did you do? I was uh 0621, a field radio operator.

Scott McLean 3:17

Field radio, okay.

Speaker 3:18

Yeah, so basically we would have to describe it as the person with a big red target on the back of their head because they have a long antenna that they're trying to take down.

Scott McLean 3:25

Yeah, yeah, that's like uh you know, in the in the Air Force, we would have like uh if we were ever had to air base ground defense, was our thing. Protect the airbase. You guys did the hard work out there, and uh not that what we would have to do would be easy, but uh you know, you have this fire team formation and uh the and guess who's up at the point? What I did, the dog handler is up front, out in front. Oh yeah, you know, uh life expectancy in a real world situation, very short. Oh, absolutely. You know, because you're working just like you.

Speaker 1 4:03

A big antenna. A hundred percent.

Scott McLean 4:06

What kind of uh what kind of action did you see there? What kind of stuff did you do down there in Central America? It's an interesting place.

Speaker 4:13

It is, it is, and I think uh we did more training than we did the action part, yeah, because it was a very um unique experience in the sense that one of the biggest takeaways that I took from there, the culture is completely different. Um, you're talking about adolescent kids, probably by the age of 12 or 13 have to make a rash decision, and that's what I mainly took about it. Uh, is you either join the cartel or you joined the military. There's really nothing in between that distincts your future. It's either you you fight for your village or you fight for the same people that are either trying to corrupt it or trying to do human trafficking or drug trafficking, and I was blessed uh with the opportunity to train those young men and women that actually made the choice that said, This is my home, this is my village, and whatever the case may be, I'm gonna do what it takes to move it forward.

Scott McLean 5:11

Interesting. So when did you get out?

Speaker 5:13

I got out in 2017, I believe. Quite a while ago.

Scott McLean 5:18

What was your and we all like to know these stories, uh, what was your transition like? Some had it easy, some have it hard, some it's like, uh, it was okay.

Speaker 5:29

Yeah, absolutely. Um the transition, I never wanted to play the victim here, but uh in my own experience, I feel like it was best described as a void, where nobody really knew anything. It was more of uh figure it out as you go. But I will uh give some kudos to my leadership as I was going out. I did have, I was blessed to have some good leadership where although they didn't know what to do or how to properly guide me, they were they were there every step of the way and let's figure it out together rather than you just go on your own. So when I hit home, I didn't even know where home wanted it to be. Because at that point, it's like you're free, you're you don't got orders, they're not telling you where to go or not to go or anything. Freddie was its own entity again. And oh man, I thought I wanted to go to California, and then my buddy told me that, oh, come to Tallahassee, Florida, but everything just revolved at that point around my family, and that's what led me back to Florida, even though Freddie could have picked any state in the United States. Uh Florida is my home. So yeah, I'm a Florida boy. Tallahouse is more like it.

Speaker 3 6:40

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Scott McLean 6:41

I am not a fan of Tallahassee. I have my two stepkids. The last one just graduated, both of them, uh, but the youngest just graduated from FSU. I did not like driving up there. No, it is a boring ass drive. Yeah, it's seven hours. It's yeah, oh Lord. And there is nothing to do up there. I'm not gonna beat up Tallahassee. Yeah, yeah. It's okay, I guess, if you're an FSU student.

Speaker 7:05

Exactly. And that was the that was the whole point. I think he was just trying to recruit me to go to FSU. Yeah. But I'm I'm I'm very appreciative for that opportunity because to your point, it's like there's nothing to do there, but there was a lot to think about. Absolutely. And it gave you that headspace of where do we go from here?

Scott McLean 7:19

How old were you when you got out?

Speaker 7:21

Uh man, 2017. Uh, you know, Marines are not good with math. We can't count past three. Uh so I want to say maybe like 22, 23.

Scott McLean 7:32

Just a kid. Yeah. Just a kid, yeah. Yeah. And not married.

Speaker 7:37

Not at that time. Right.

Scott McLean 7:39

So, and where is home down down here in South Florida?

Speaker 7:42

Yes. Uh, specifically in Palm Beach County.

Scott McLean 7:44

Okay. Yeah. All right. Came back. It was probably the right choice.

Speaker 1 7:48

Yeah, maybe.

Scott McLean 7:49

Yeah. That'd been Tallahassee.

Speaker 1 7:51

Depends on who who you ask, right? I guess you're right. Some people want me, some people don't.

Scott McLean 7:56

I guess you're right. So you kicked around for a little while. Yeah. Sure, you had a couple of jobs here and there. Absolutely. Um, when did you get uh into the position you're in? How did that come about?

Speaker 8:09

Oh man, that's uh a roller coaster in itself. Because um, upon getting out, um, I didn't know what I wanted to do, but I knew what I was very interested in. And that's the four to five inches in between our ears, the brain. And although I didn't know what I was gonna do with it or anything, uh, it's kind of to that point where, you know, if you do something you love, you'll never work a day of your life. And I really was so interested in uh the brain and how it functions, what it does, what it doesn't do. You know, there's so much to learn about it. And I started pursuing my uh bachelor's in neurobehavioral science. Uh, to that end, I was like, okay, maybe I could become a doctor and do this thing for for a long, very long time, helping people again. Because once uh I hung up my uniform and I laced my boots one last time, it's a tough

The Void After Leaving Military

Speaker 9:00

pill to swallow, knowing that when you wake up the next day, I don't know if it's going to be meaningful as it was the days before. And that was the one of the biggest voids that I had to find it within myself to fill. And Freddie did some crazy stuff, man. When I got out and before I even pursued the uh degree, I went to go swim with sharks without a cage, even though the guy recommended I go with the cage. I went um uh skydiving, all these different crazy things just to get that adrenaline, that feeling. That dopamine hit. That dopamine hit, and we'll talk about that.

Scott McLean 9:32

And that's very those are dangerous, very dangerous, exactly.

Speaker 9:35

And that's why I said I was blessed.

Scott McLean 9:36

Especially when you cap out, yeah, you start looking for more.

Speaker 9:39

Yeah, yeah. That leads to addiction too. Um certain ways. What what better way to distract yourself than to pick a hard subject that you really love? And that's where I started my uh journey to become essentially a doctor. The pre-med, the whole line, and then COVID hit. And like everybody else's uh experience, many have different experiences. I feel like life just paused for whatever reason. And then within that pause, kind of like any type of um pinnacle in life, you either uh grab it by the foundation and take charge of it, or you you allow it to take charge of you. And that pause gave me uh an insight of entrepreneurship. I started exploring that, uh, created uh an e-commerce business with uh my wife um on the side. And then I really loved it because not only were we helping people, we were finding solutions to these issues. Uh so then little by little I started this uh seed started growing within me of like I really want to help people, but not in a materialistic way. There has to be something else. So that's when I gave it over to my wife. She took it over from there, and then I kept on searching. And then uh one thing led to another, then I became a pharmaceutical rep because I assumed that at that point um pharmacy uh was something that I could help people with, giving the medication that gives them some sense of relief into whatever symptom or pain. And then I started going down rabbit holes and reading more books and really knowing the nuances of well, if you take this pill, six more issues will happen. And then, you know, we're gonna fix this toenail, but you might lose a leg. And I'm like, okay, I gotta step back. And I think what really uh opened up my eyes was one specific uh scenario or patient that we had where it was actually a uh newborn, three-month baby, and they had to prescribe them uh anti-HIV medication as a as a newborn, and it was $10,000 a month. And obviously there's eight out there, but I mean, at that point in the moment, I just knew that I wanted to help people in a different way, and not in a way that I had to place a bill in front of them every month for $10,000 a month for somebody that hasn't even begun a living. Uh so then that geared me into a different trajectory, and I'm like, okay, but where where is this feeling coming from? I need to find out, and that's where it led me back to our community, our people, our veterans, first responders, and active military. It's like, how can I really help my community? And then I started uh dabbling into uh behavioral health a little bit more, deeper and deeper. And then a buddy of mine actually caught me right before I was on my way to Sweden, because that's where my wife is from, and he was like, Freddie, I I can't let you go. We need you to stay right here. Uh, what if I could find you a really good job and they'll give you the autonomy to do what you love doing best? Will you reconsider your relocation? And I'm like, sure. And his name is Alex. Sure, Alex, tell me what kind of color unicorn you're gonna give me, and I'll consider it. Because at that point, it's like there was nothing changing my mind. Um, my wife, I had my wife, my kid was on the way, the whole nine. It and I don't know if you agree with this, but it really takes a village to raise children, and that's something that I wasn't blessed in this area at least to be surrounded by my parents or whatnot, or brothers and sisters. So I was trying to do not what's best for me, but for my family at that point. And lo and behold, Alex comes back with a yellow unicorn, and that yellow unicorn is Sunwave, where I have amazing leadership, it's an amazing company that really is. When you ask me, he's like, What is it that you do? And I believe all of my colleagues will agree that we do one thing, we really just help people in a different manner. And came to me, my uh my boss Wayne Johnson asked me, he's like, Okay, uh, tell me, what do you what do you do? What do you like to do? Da-da-da. And I remember the interview just like it was yesterday because I came in all suited up with a tie, the tight clasp, shirt stays. For those of you that don't know what shirt stays are, is those little rubber bands that uh uncomfortably lay around your thigh area to make sure that everything's nice and tight and that's a military uniform thing, right? 100%. He was lucky I didn't show up in my dress blues. Um, and then when I showed up, the first thing he told me is like, Freddie, I need you to listen to me and just do one thing before we begin. I'm like, sure, whatever you want. You're about to give me a relaxed. Yeah, he told me, take off that freaking tie.

Adrenaline Seeking And Finding Purpose

Speaker 14:20

Nice, it was a nice tie, though. It was blue and pink. Okay. Uh and he goes, just take off that tie. You looked so you know tense and structured and this and that. And I'm like, gonna go. It was a it was a weird interview. Yeah, gonna go. And then I took it off, and it was kind of like a weight off my shoulder because I'm like, all right, this is not your uh you know, traditional interview, so I need to do things a little bit different. And he what he wanted when he told me to take off my tie was just be human, show me who Freddie really is, because that's what's gonna really tell me how successful you're gonna be in this environment. And I'm glad he did. And he probably saw something that I didn't see in myself, and he hired me right on the spot, and then I just had one ask of them is that allow me my own lane where I get the opportunity to conversate, connect, and listen to my community, my community, and see uh how can we help, whether that's the software or a resource, whatever, because at the end of the day, we're in an industry of helping people.

Scott McLean 15:26

I just want to touch on something real quick that you mentioned earlier in that. So it's a great story, by the way. Thank you for sharing that. Um you said pharmaceuticals, and immediately, immediately my brain went to veterans and pharmaceuticals are not like veterans do not really care too much for the pharmaceutical world. It's um I love the VA and I know people like yeah the but I it helped me and it continues to help me. And I can't badmouth, it has its flaws. It's a huge ship that turning it around is not like a speed boat, right? But um I have run into people that just like to give medication, you know, and uh that creates uh anxieties, but isn't that what the medication's for?

Speaker 3 16:22

Right, right, right, yeah, yeah.

Scott McLean 16:24

It adds a little to it actually, in some cases. Um sometimes the pills don't work, you know, they just don't. So I'm glad you kind of went in another direction. And that you saw this and you saw the there's an upside and a downside to everything, yeah. Right? And you had to weigh that option and you said no, the downside isn't worth it. No, you know, and I loved your analogy, like we can fix your toenail, but we're gonna cut your leg off. All that really rapid speed talking at the end of every fucking pharmaceutical commercial. This might be because it might be because of this. Oh, why all symptoms of paradise in the background?

Speaker 17:07

It's like happy and shiny.

Scott McLean 17:09

I I don't know if this is good for my podcast, but I'm just gonna say that pharmaceutical is fucking big tobacco of the eighties and nineties. They are we shouldn't be seeing pharmaceutical commercials on TV. But I digress. No, no, no, no. I'm glad we did it. Um, so you got this. Now, what does Sunwave do?

Speaker 5 17:34

Okay.

Speaker 17:34

That's a really interesting question. Um and I'll give you two answers. Okay. Um We got plenty of time, my friend. And the reason why I want to give you two answers is because the first thing that comes to mind is one of my favorite quotes from Einstein. He basically states, and I'm probably gonna butcher this, and I'm glad the guy's not alive yet, because then he'll judge me for it, is that if you can't explain it to a four-year-old, you don't know what the hell you're talking about. So uh the first analogy that I would like to explain of what Sunwave does is imagine you're playing a game, and the whole concept of the game is how far you can make it a dist a certain distance, and you have balls, each ball different color, but depending on the color that you have is how many bounces it's able to do. Typically, in our community right now, in the drug addiction and behavioral health, all the facilities are equipped with certain color balls where the blue ball will only take you maybe two bounces, green ball, maybe four bounces. But every time they're trying to go a different distance, they're having to find themselves to change the color of ball to make it to that distance. Now, Sunwave supplies you with the yellow ball, the yellow ball will take you to that distance needed to reach that goal of winning the game, and that's essentially what Sunwave does for

Why He Left Pharma Behind

Speaker 18:55

a four-year-old. Now, for an adult that would like to, you know, uh understand this a little bit better. The best way I could explain it, and this is actually an analogy that I just recently used to, is imagine walking down the bread aisle, everybody's selling bread, everybody has their own packaging, some bread may be shaped differently, da-da-da. But you're having to find yourself in an uncomfortable place where which logo looks the best, what shape looks the best, you read the back of the ingredients, and then you try to dictate which is the best ingredients for you. But at the end of the day, you're gonna have to select something that's already on the shelf. But what if I could tell you that we could give you a whole bakery? And within that bakery, there's our baker that's able to bake cookies, muffins, use whatever ingredients that it is that you want, so you don't have to find yourself in an uncomfortable situation where you're just having to pick something that's already on the shelf. And that's what South Sunwave offers a very tailored software system where we understand that we're dealing with humans. Each human brings their own unique aspect to the therapy or the facility, and we have to keep that in mind that everybody's different. And as such, the facilities are different. So we should not be offering you a system that you have to get uncomfortable with it versus the other way around. So we have our own personal baker that's able to tailor that software system based on your unique needs and workflows.

Scott McLean 20:28

The unique needs and workflows are geared toward uh like uh clinics, clinicians, uh people treating uh the symptoms, drug addiction or PTSD, or uh you know, traumatic brain does traumatic brain injury, all of those above. So what does a veteran program mean to a tech company?

Speaker 20:51

Great question.

Scott McLean 20:52

Yeah.

Speaker 20:53

So a veteran program for a tech company means a plethora of things. But in this instance, we we know that there's a need and there's a gap and more likely a disparity between the stigma behind behavioral health and the way that we approach treatment. And a lot what uh our vendors out there practice is uh they want to make sure that everything you need is within one system and that you live and breathe within that system so you don't have to do anything else outside of it. But our model is completely different and reverse. And let me ask you a question, Scott. And I don't want to assume anything. Interview the interviewer.

Speaker 1 21:34

I have no problems with that.

Speaker 21:36

What do you believe the average clinician or executive at a facility? How much time do they spend on a day-to-day within that their computer system? Uh percentage-wise.

Scott McLean 21:47

All right. Well, I I have a little bit of an inside uh look at that. My wife's a north practitioner uh for one of the cities around Boca. And She also has her own private practice on the side and I I see like she'll are you supposed she's supposed to get off at five. Five thirty six you know five forty five and I'll call her usually if I haven't seen her on Life 360 uh and she'll say I'm charting. Charting, charting, charting. Because they see the patients, they don't have time to do all that. Then they usually do it afterwards. So I know how much time and and they spend they could spend quite a bit of time depending on how many people they see and what the issues are of the people they're seeing. So yeah, it's they spend a lot of time on other than uh the patient. It could be a 50-50

Sunwave Explained With Simple Analogies

Scott McLean 22:45

split almost in a day, but you go into overtime.

Speaker 22:48

Yeah. No, you hit you hit it right on the money, it's it's over 54%. Yeah. Clinicians and executives spend over 54% of their time within their software system or computer, sitting behind a screen. Yep. And that's why we did the reverse model. We want you to spend less time on your computer, on your software system, and more client-facing. So we did a study, and with our software, because of how robust and tailored it is uh to the nature, is they actually spend, and I'm probably butchering this, about maybe 22, 23% of the time with our software system. And we have an ultimate goal within the next 12 to 18 months to reduce that all the way down to 12%, because the less time they spend on their computer, the more time they could spend with their patient. And that's exactly what we need. And that's what it has so much benefits. Not only is the client getting more face-to-face time, but you're also reducing burnout rate to your point of your wife having a time in mind, she's gonna come home, but no, that that's not realistic because she has so much notes to do, and that's what we want to provide to our executives and clinicians more time back because that's the most sacred resource we have in life.

Scott McLean 24:00

So again, getting back to the the veteran aspect of it, yeah. What's the what's the the correlation?

Speaker 24:07

Yeah, absolutely. So the correlation there is that before we used to be uh approaching this from how do I explain it? Outcomes has become a great tool now. Before it was you do a therapy treatment, you did it, check in the box, you file a claim with the VA. That's it. You got paid, they got paid, the pay uh the veteran got treatment, but now we're geared more towards outcomes. Can you actually prove that what you're doing is actually working? How can you show me the trajectory of point zero to point Z? And if it's going up or down, and then as a software company, you're only as good as the data you're collecting. So our software is able to collect certain pinpoints and data points, and one of the tools that we actually utilize is BAM, which is the basic drug addiction uh survey that we utilize and we collect those data points to see how how are they coming in at time zero? And then as the therapy is going, is the trajectory of their therapy helping them or making it worse? And we're empowering clinicians with those data points so they could rearrange the trajectory of their therapy to better help their veterans.

Scott McLean 25:26

Do you uh does uh Sunwave have any uh connection or future connection or anything with the VA in any way, shape, or form, or is the VA just gonna be the VA?

Speaker 25:37

That is the golden question, Scott. Yeah. And that is my my dream and my passion to bridge that gap and to connection. Uh there's such a huge disparity with clinics and uh facility owners where they don't know or understand how to even navigate that. And my sole mission is to get Sunwave to that point where we have a voice loud enough to number one say we matter. And number two, tell us what it is gonna take for us to properly have this symbiotic relationship where to the goal that we're trying to help veterans. I just need the data. I just need to know what it is that you're looking for, and then our team will be more than happy to make that relationship and bridge that gap so we can help these facilities that do have veteran programs, but they don't have the data points to speak on.

Scott McLean 26:24

So let's let's let's talk a little about the data. So veterans and first responders, um there's a number of us that deal with uh I call the triple threat. You have uh you have uh trauma, addiction, depression. Right? How does data putting all that together, how how does the data make it easier to deal with the triple threat? If you know what I mean.

Speaker 26:56

Yeah, that's a good question. I find it that once we identify using this data, of course, yeah, once we see where the nuances lie, one being the stigma behind it. Right. Like, for example, you know, as soon as you come in, you're you're interviewed, kind of asking a million questions and making sure that you have all the background behind it, and that kind of like puts a roadblock in front of us and doesn't allow us to open up as much. But if we utilize the data of what are some common questions that the veteran or first responder or active duty military person is able to ask without triggering any type of that stigma

Cutting Screen Time And Burnout

Speaker 27:40

and is allowing them to open more up.

Scott McLean 27:43

That's not easy.

Speaker 27:44

It's not easy, but before the podcast we even ask, it's like it's about asking the right questions to open up the right doors that can lead us into new deeper realms. And that's how we could I foresee us using a lot utilizing that data, asking the right questions that will open up these doors to unlock that triple threat and letting them know that the door is open and there is help and there is no judgment behind it. And that's the data that our clinicians can utilize to ask those right questions and have that welcoming uh environment for the veteran or first responder to come in and seek help.

Scott McLean 28:19

So, how does the software keep the clinic in the veteran kind of after the treatment? How do they keep them connected? Is that a human thing? It's up to the veteran, uh, because there is that that part in play. Uh, there are, and I I'll only speak for veterans and first responders. I was a first responder also after I was a veteran. Um there's the human element, then there's the there's those of us that are just like, tell me what to do now.

Speaker 3 28:46

Yeah.

Scott McLean 28:47

You know, afterwards, or what do I do? Uh I'm a big believer in aftercare, even with my found one man, one mic foundation. I have an aftercare, and it's pretty much not aftercare in the normal sense because I'm uh doing something outside the box, but it's staying in touch. It's it's just kind of hey, I'll help you whatever you need with your podcast anytime you ever need it, questions, answers, things like that. Keep a connection because connection's important, right? Yeah. So how does it? I guess the question is, how does it assist in the aftercare?

Speaker 29:22

Yeah, that's a beautiful question. And it goes back to uh my four-year-old analogy, right? Do you have the right color ball to take you the distance? And part of taking you to that distance is that what we like to call in our space the alumni program. And most uh people out there or vendors don't have that special color ball that already has an alumni system in place, and we're proud to say that we do because the magic doesn't happen through, although, yes, there's some magic that happens before and during the therapy, but the real magic is how are you gonna utilize what we equipped you with, the knowledge, the therapy after the fact, because we're not always gonna be there, and that's where the alumni uh system component comes into place, where in combination with the human aspect, you are able to maintain touch with that patient. And ever so often you could send them surveys which those special questions that are not gonna push them further away, but kind of actually stimulate them to actually answer those questions, and depending on how they answer those questions, it triggers back to our system letting us know are they in the green area or are they in the red area before the relapse happens?

Scott McLean 30:35

Before say you see they're in the red land, they're in the red. Yeah, they're a race car in the red. And to quote Samuel L. Jackson from Pulp Fiction, it ain't good to have a race car in the red.

Speaker 1 30:45

No, no, no, no. Right? That's a great movie.

Scott McLean 30:48

That was the brains in the car situation. Yeah. Um so how how do you how do you approach that? They the clinician that's using the software, yeah, sees this, and I again I it's a human aspect. Uh everyone deals with things differently, clinicians. But so say you're the clinician and you see this comeback survey, I'll call it come back, and you're like, oh, how does that get approached? Like, uh is there a reach out? Is there like, hey, you know, we're here? Yeah. Like, how does that play out?

Speaker 31:22

Yeah. Uh I would say that every facility runs their alumni program a little different. Okay, yeah. Our software is meant to do what the human aspect can and to be present where we can't be present. And as soon as that survey gets back, the system gets triggered, a red flag, and then it basically notifies the clinician to reach out, whichever way it was. Uh, I know some facilities they go and in person go and visit the client if they know their address. Some clinicians they go ahead and pick up the phone. Uh, others

Outcomes Data And Bridging The VA

Speaker 31:55

they don't have so much time because of the system that they're using, they're just sending out emails. So it's really very nuanced on how the approach happens. We're just there providing them with a system that actually gives them that opportunity before it gets real.

Scott McLean 32:11

So let's kind of uh and and okay, let's talk about a stigma for a minute. There is in today's society, and uh, I remember my wife bringing this up years ago, uh, about data mining, right? And she was kind of ahead of the curve on that. She wasn't alone. There's a lot of people that that, but not the majority of the people, I didn't know anything about data mining, right? So there's become a stigma about data on social media. Like, why did I talk about going to St. Augustine for the Fourth of July and all of a sudden um, you know, I tapped on something and I'm getting advertisements for restaurants in St. Augustine? Which, by the way, St. Augustine on the Fourth of July is one of the greatest places I've ever been to in my life. Just to for the record. How does that play into any of this? Is there a safety net for the for the veteran or the first responders? Because that's basically what I'm geared toward. Uh, is there a safety net for their data?

Speaker 33:20

That's a great question.

Scott McLean 33:21

Yeah.

Speaker 33:21

Yeah. And um the short answer is yes. Yeah. And the reason being is uh I I gotta give it to our founders and our board members because they really thought about everything. And I always tell everybody what makes it special is not necessarily our software, but it's the people behind the software because we truly do listen to their opinions. And that's actually one of the things that they brought up data security. So what's practiced right now is called a Frankenstein style system, where because you don't have those specific color balls within your um toolbox, you're having to find yourself connecting to third party systems. One for the note taking, a separate system for the referral program, a separate system for alumni. And because you're having these third-party connections, there is some leakage of data. Uh, a couple of years back, there was a huge PHI incident between um, I forgot the name of the company, but they stored uh one of the largest networks of PHI information of PHI means, uh personal health information uh of the clients. And there was a huge data leakage, and the primary cause was because there was a third-party connection. With Sunwave, there is no third-party connection. Everything is built within one roof, one house. So you don't have to have that worry about well, is it gonna get shared with anybody? Is it training anything? We're not training any other system except for our own to make sure that we amplify our system enough to stay in touch with the clinician and arming them with what they need, all with the same comfort of your data is safe, period.

Scott McLean 35:03

How can so let's kind of shift gears here? How can boots like boots on the ground nonprofits and foundations um team up in any way, shape, or form with Sunwave? If there's a foundation out there that says, Oh, we because most nonprofits collect the data because that shows what they need to improve, uh, and it's on a very small scale, unless it's a huge foundation or a huge organization. Yeah. Um, but is there a way for, like I said, boots on the ground nonprofits to kind of have Sunwave help them out with how their data is collected or how they do things?

Speaker 35:50

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Uh number one, they could always reach out uh to me. Right. At any point, uh everything starts with the conversation. We need we don't know what we don't know until we have a conversation, and we don't know how to best help you unless we know what those pain points are. So the first thing that I would say is reach out. The second thing is be open-minded about the type of conversation we're gonna have because at the end of the day, we're in the same space trying to help people, more specifically, our community. Right. And then once we're able to have that conversation, we'll we'll know how to move forward from there. Because that's one of the biggest things is that a lot of people don't want to have this conversation because they feel like, oh, it's gonna lead towards uh rabbit holes or this and that. It's like, no, this is new to all of us, and at the end of the day, it's us versus the stigma behind it. And if we want people to be more open-minded to therapy and to ask for help, we have to create that environment to make them feel like they're welcome.

Scott McLean 36:51

This is just a uh a very uh kind of off the cuff thought. Um, and I really am not in that world that you're in, right? But it sounds like Sunwave has a good opportunity to start their own

Alumni Aftercare And Relapse Signals

Scott McLean 37:05

nonprofit to help nonprofits. Just I don't know if it's right or wrong, but and I'm not hinting at anything.

Speaker 37:14

I will find that once I get back to work. It just sounds like something that, you know, and I how old is Sunwave?

Scott McLean 37:19

So Sunwave was founded in 2013, relatively new in the in the big picture of of tech world, right? Um yeah, that was just kind of a uh a thought on the side. Maybe being a nonprofit, I'm kinda you know, partial to that. Um if you could change one thing about the healthcare system that handles uh veterans' mental health right now, what would it be? Veterans are first responders' mental health from your experience.

Speaker 38:02

I would say the manner of which we listen would be the number one thing that I feel like would be a power driver. And what I mean by that is not bombarding us with follow-up or more medication or you know, a whole bunch of crap for us to do, but rather just really actively, genuinely listen to what our need is, what we're looking for, and understand that we all come in different color clo crayons and that we all each need different types of help. And kind of like to the amazing thing that you're doing here, sometimes we just need a mic, we just need somebody to listen to, not medications, not a nice fluffy couch where we could open up our feelings to or anything like that. It's just to just really listen. Yeah, that's where I think what I would change.

Scott McLean 39:01

Good answer, by the way, because you you're pretty much right about well again, we're we're the same people, yeah. Right? We're the same people. Uh, what is the data that you that you're aware of? Uh maybe you're not, but uh what how how what's the scale of how you can read like read how the data is helping, say, veterans uh uh or first responders? Like, is it does this is there uh something that says that uh it's really helping like the program, what you do, what you guys offer? Yeah. I I guess I don't know, maybe that's too broad of a question because what you do covers a lot.

Speaker 39:43

It's so nuanced.

Scott McLean 39:44

Yeah, and I guess it would be that would be a question geared towards specific clinicians that deal with it. Maybe they'd probably have a better idea on how to handle it, but give me your off-the-cuff answer on that. I mean, uh I suppose it's gotta help.

Speaker 40:02

Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely. I mean, there's so many great programs out there. Uh, for example, I took a trip over to uh Virginia and they're using equine therapy. It's like, how do you how do you gaze familiar with that? Okay, so it's like how do we collect the data point on that? I mean, we can't ask the horse, but at the same time, we know that uh one of the interesting facts uh that they taught me was that the horse could feel or could sense the beats per minute of your heart three minutes before it even starts increasing. Like 10 feet away, they can feet away. Yeah, which is crazy. How do we collect that type of data? But we know it works.

Scott McLean 40:42

I am proof of it. Yeah. Okay, perfect. They changed my life. Ethant therapy changed my life. Yeah. You know, in well, and the thing with that, I don't want to go down that rabbit hole. We've we've talked over a lot about rabbit holes, but uh the thing uh with that is is horses. Um, you know, people try to compare them all. They see my my dog does this, and you know, or I've seen whatever mannerism or quirky thing a horse might do. And well, I was taught almost immediately that there's a difference. Dogs are predators, horses are prey, and they will always be prey, and they always have been prey. So horses live in PTSD, they live in it.

Speaker 2 41:22

Wow.

Scott McLean 41:22

On a on a second to second scale, they live in PTSD. So, what better animal to deal with a human that has PTSD than a horse? Because to dogs will come right up to you. You can kick a dog. I worked with dogs for 32 years. I have a degree in canine science, I know all there is about dogs. You can kick a dog, and three minutes later that dog's coming back to you. Unconditional love type thing. Trust everything. Horses don't, they have to learn to trust, just like people with PTSD or traumatic brain injury. Yeah, there's there's levels. One of those levels is I I don't trust anybody. So when you connect with a horse, that is an amazing experience. And yeah, how do you register that on a survey?

Speaker 1 42:14

You can't that's what's it on a scale on what you call that magic.

Scott McLean 42:17

How did I feel when I came out of the arena?

Speaker 1 42:20

Uh fucking ten.

Scott McLean 42:21

Yeah, but a number doesn't do it any justice. No, no, you know, so you're uh that's a great, great uh uh point. How do you measure that, right? Yeah, so I guess in the end, every individual is different. And

Data Security Without Third Parties

Scott McLean 42:35

to answer my own question, you can't really measure it. You have to see them, you have to talk to them. Absolutely, you know, or you get them on a microphone and they tell you they tell you the experience, yeah, you know, and uh that's in itself is a whole is a whole different thing, right? Um how does the software okay, so say there's uh uh uh there's a veteran in in crisis and uh they reach out, does the software to the clinician that they're working with, uh how does the software expedite anything that they might want to do other than call 911, call you know the the veteran heartline and stuff like that? What gives the clinician uh an uh a hand up? Does your software give the clinician or any a hand up on because not everybody's gonna call that. They'll call the person that is that they're working with. Right. Yeah. So does the software give that clinician or that specific uh group or business a hand up on helping this this person?

Speaker 2 43:46

Absolutely.

Speaker 43:47

Yeah. I I feel like um there's a golden nugget in every section of where our software helps, as an example. Uh, to your point, you know, the veteran might reach out by different modes, it could. Be via uh internet. You fill out a basic form, and they'll probably just put John Doe on there just to preserve their own identity, but they know that they need help, or they could pick up the phone. Our system is able to pick up any type of outreach, whether it's a form being filled out online, it goes straight to our system. They pick up the phone, that information as far as phone number, the possibility of who owns that phone could be automatically populated, collecting that basic demographic before they even say the first hello. That already automatically is saving the clinician or that front uh desk person so much time where they could again focus more on the person and on the conversation rather than it being an interview right off the back. What's your phone number? What's your address? What's this? What's that? And by the time you're done with that intake sheet, what they call it, you're like, can't can I talk about what I'm here for now? And it's like, no, no, no, I have one more question to fill out.

Scott McLean 44:58

That's the aggravating thing about 911, evidently. I've fortunately have never had to call 911, but you see it and hear it all the time. They have to ask you a handful of questions, which is pertinent, it's pertinent to the person taking the intake, right? Because they can now disperse the proper information about that person. But when you call in that situation, yeah, the last thing you want to do is fucking answer questions. Yeah.

Speaker 2 45:25

Yeah, yeah.

Scott McLean 45:26

You hear those on the TV shows now. You hear like, I'm telling you, somebody just got okay. I need to know, I need to know. And it's uh it's hard to, but the software could alleviate some of that, yes?

Speaker 45:38

Absolutely. Yeah. Collect exactly what you need right before you even say the first hello. And again, the whole point here is saving you time. And number two, be more people, be more of a client-facing conversation that you'll get the data that you want as long as you do it with the right approach. And if we could eliminate that stressor or the anxiety of I have to collect these data points before I could continue this conversation, I think that moves the needle in the right direction for us to have a conversation.

Scott McLean 46:07

Uh, one more question about this, then I want to get into the the event that you're that you're that you're putting together. God bless you for that.

Speaker 46:14

We, we, we.

Speaker 1 46:15

It's a community of it's a community. It's it's him.

Scott McLean 46:20

Uh, if a veteran is seeing uh uh a private uh clinician and they decide uh oh the clinician retires or they move on to another. Because I I say this about therapists, psychologists, psychiatrists. I'm also a recovering alcoholic, 36 years. Wow, and I know well enough, I've learned over those years that uh, and it's this is more uh of a lesson at the beginning that uh you go to AA, right? AA was a big part of helping me stay sober, but not every AA meeting is the same. I've talked to uh veterans mostly and first responders uh about the you know the AA meeting, and they're like, that sucked. Then go to another one. They're not all the same. Every meeting has a different flavor, it's a different color crayon to use your analogy. Um and then you'll find the one that you're comfortable with. You know, I went through four therapists with the VA, three like there and gone. That's a problem with the VA. You know, you gotta start, and there it is with the questions fucking all over again. Really? My shit isn't right there? Like what the fuck? And I'm just being blunt. Like it's it was very frustrating to have to I got a new

How Nonprofits Can Partner Up

Scott McLean 47:45

therapist now, I gotta go fucking do all this shit again. I've already talked about this, right? I want to move forward until you settle with the one that works and you're like, this is the one. Yeah. Like she, in my case, fucking absolutely amazing. Unfortunately, she just left after five years. But um so a veteran decides this this clinician isn't working for me. I gotta go to another clinician now. Does their records through through Sunwave follow them from one place to another? Or do is it a unless so say it's a Sunwave, so these are using them, they're using them. Can they access that? Or is that like well, they have to retake, do the intake all over again?

Speaker 48:31

Yeah, it's such a great question. Because I feel like that's where most of our frustration comes from. Yeah. Revisiting those traumas, retelling the story, reliving, reliving.

Scott McLean 48:40

It's reliving.

Speaker 48:41

Yeah, yeah. Reliving it. So, what I will say is that something that's so unique about our system is like when does the front desk coordinator ever talk to the clinician? And when does the clinician ever talk to the other departments? Because it is a unified system, and I'm talking within the facility, they do they do talk to each other. And to your point, it's like sometimes the clinician can't scroll through a hundred pages worth of intakes to see what was the last time that we had a conversation and what was that about? Our system is able to retract and revisit those significant events and kind of give them an overview of what's been going on. And then when they do their notes, the system itself is already taken into consideration of what was written previous sessions, so then they could have a well thought-through biocycle social, for example. Now, the second part of uh your question is like, well, what if the patient goes from uh one facility to a second facility? And that's where it gets very nuanced because of the security protocol.

Scott McLean 49:42

Yeah, yeah, that's what I was curious about. Yeah.

Speaker 49:44

The security protocol is so sensitive where although you guys are using Sunwave, again, everybody has their own unique workflows, their unique ways. Yes. So it makes it very difficult for us to send the same information over to the other one if it's not correlating with the same workflow. Now, what I will say is that clinics do have referral partner agreements, they're very community uh-based where they talk to each other, and there's there's such a small community that they talk to each other just enough that they give them the background that they need in order to move the needle again in the right direction, and saying, Hey, I'm sending you Freddie, and this is what's been going on with Freddie, and this is how I I believe if you approach it in this manner, will help you move the needle in the right direction. So that's one way to mitigate that.

Scott McLean 50:35

Mitigate it, exactly. You will never eliminate it because again, human factor. Correct. Every clinician works differently, yeah. They have the different methods. So uh and that I was as I asked that question, I was thinking about it. And uh it's probably so I was thinking that oh, maybe it just transfers over and that's that, but that wouldn't be good. That shows that anybody can access it. You know, if they just say, hey, I got Freddie over here, tick, tick, tick, tick, tick. Hey, sun wave, yeah, sure, take his data. Yeah, take all this information. No, no, yeah, it's so sensitive. I thought about it. I'm like, that was not meant to be a trap question, but I never asked trap questions. Um, but it sounded like I'm thinking, oh, I hope he answers this right. Right how I see it. What about a question? You're the expert. Um all right, let's talk about the uh the panel that you you reached out to me, uh Tim Roberto. I love Tim. Tim's a great guy. Yeah, yeah. Um tell us what that's all about. What's going on with that?

Speaker 51:42

Yeah. Uh that was actually one of the negotiating factors that I uh had coming into Sunwave. Again, my own lane, very community-based. And Sunwave has been, even before I came in, have been community-based, but we've never really dwelled into the veteran or community sector. Um, Jason Miller, who's our director of sales operations, purple heart recipient, he's been uh fighting tooth and nail to make sure we amplify this outreach.

Measuring What Therapy Really Changes

Speaker 52:10

And again, thanks to his support and leadership support, they're giving me that platform or that uh autonomy to see what's needed in the community and get people together because we want to be seen first as a resource and anything else that follows, so be it. So uh we're creating kind of like the uh we're gathering the team of Avengers in Florida, South Florida, of some of the top guys, including yourself, uh Tim Roberto, and then I have uh Jonathan along with uh two other uh pastor.

Scott McLean 52:41

Jonathan Sessa from Warrior Golf.

Speaker 52:43

From Warrior Golf. And I just said, hey, I want you guys to amplify your message. Tell us what's working, what's not. Going back to that data port. The software is not what makes us great, is our people that makes us great. And if we're not able to have these conversations, we don't know how to move forward with our software system. So we've gathered our team of Avengers in South Florida, getting them together. At that point, I'll have the mic and asking the questions to see what's working, what's not, and we're inviting or we're we're trying to reach out to uh 35 to 45 executives within the behavioral health or addiction treatment center to just show up. 90% of the effort if you ever want to contribute or help our community is just showing up, picking up the phone, kind of like you. When I first uh met you and I called you, the first thing that you asked me was in what do you want from me? It's more of how can I help? Absolutely, and that's exactly what we're looking for. So, yeah, we're right now, right after this. I'm gonna be knocking on doors, uh old school style, saying hello. We're uh trying to where race awareness for PTSD, as we know, is June 27th. Uh, but uh the event itself is gonna be hosted on June 23rd, uh, during lunchtime. So there is no excuse not to come uh because you if you're gonna eat good food, do it around people that are good people and that have a good cause. So come on out.

Scott McLean 54:12

Right. And it's a five-person panel. Yep. And you'll be asking us the questions, right? And the audience will be, you know, executives in healthcare in in the mental health world. And I can't see how they wouldn't want to hear what we have to say. You know, because we're representing a a very small niche community. You know, in the big picture, veterans is a very small group. There's a lot of us, and not all of us have you know the problems, the troubles, as we the Irish say, the troubles. Um but I can't see how they would not want to hear you know what we have to say and ask us, because what better way? It's an open forum, right? Other than the questions that you'll be asking us. Uh I I I think it's a great idea. I think I think something really, really positive will come out of that, even if it's just one of the attendees saying, you know what? I have a fucking idea. Wow, I I know or or better yet, I never thought of that. That's what you want to hear. Oh, I never thought of that. You know, uh because we are a very diverse group of people. Um and I think what you're doing is a great idea. And I think it should be done more often. Absolutely. You know, and hopefully, you know, some wave gives you that that as they seem to be doing, you know, this could be a twice-a-year thing. There's a lot of of people down here that have a lot to say, you know, that can help put us uh in a in a bigger light, not that we're trying to steal the whole spotlight, as you know, right?

Speaker 56:02

But we don't like the spotlight. Yeah, not too.

Scott McLean 56:05

Some of us do. I can tell you some of us. But I'm not gonna get into all that. Veterans are very, you know, there's a curtain, right? Yeah, there's a curtain. And I always say this. Like I worked for CBP for customs of board effective for 22 years. Great agency, great, but there's a curtain. Yeah. That you

Faster Intake For People In Crisis

Scott McLean 56:25

pull back the curtain, yeah, it might not be what you think it is. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like, and I love to say this that everybody that's a non-veteran, I I used to call them civilians. I had to change my vernacular. Uh, that's a non-veteran thinks that every veteran gets along and we all love each other and we're all in it together. Oh, contra. Yeah, it is not actually the case. Yeah, yeah. We have a common bond. We do have a love for each other, doesn't mean we have to like each other.

Speaker 56:57

It's kind of like siblings. I mean, you know, we fight each other, but the moment outside of that circle comes into our circle, now we have each other's back. It's like, no, we could only mess with each other. Exactly.

Speaker 1 57:07

Nobody else can mess with us. Yeah. He might be an asshole. Well, she might be an asshole. But that's my asshole.

Speaker 5 57:12

Because he's my asshole. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 57:14

Absolutely. Yeah. No. And I and I hope everybody, you know, uh really sees this message. And even if they can't come out today, at least reach out to see what's what's going on. What when is the next event? Right? Yeah. Uh one of the biggest things that I found is that a lot of executives are not very fond of going into their own backyards. Like some of the answers are literally your next door neighbor. But we've lived in this society now that it's really hard to have a conversation or knock on somebody's door because everybody's always thinking that they want something from you. When in reality, now we're just trying to understand a little bit better so we could help a little bit better. Absolutely. And that's what you know, all this is about.

Scott McLean 57:53

Yeah, yeah. And I I'll I'll tell you this off the air, I'll tell you on the air, I'll tell you anytime if there's anything I could ever do for you. Of course, you know, I'll I'll help you out, man. I love shit like this. I think it's needed. I think there's more. Anytime you're having an event, you can come back on the podcast.

Speaker 2 58:12

Absolutely.

Scott McLean 58:13

Absolutely. Thank you. Anything that's happening that you want to promote, if you can't come on, just let me know and I'd be more than glad to promote it for you. I think we need more of that. Uh, I think there's a lot of skepticism in the veteran community. Uh, I think a lot of people look at things like, oh, I've seen that before, I've heard that before, I've done that before, you know. Um but there's certain things that break through.

Speaker 2 58:37

Yeah.

Scott McLean 58:38

You know, and uh sometimes an outsider needs to be the person, and not that you're that outsider, but maybe one of these clinicians, one of these executives, mental health people show up and say, I can I think I can break that, you know, that glass ceiling. Yeah. You know, for veterans. And every little bit helps. Absolutely.

Speaker 58:57

At the end of the day, it's not a one-person fight, it takes a village to ignite this flame because you never know what resource or knowledge somebody has, and it's just waiting again to asking that right question, opening that right door, and that's what it's gonna take. That one door to open, that's really gonna be that light and that veteran or first responder with really connecting with them.

Scott McLean 59:19

And there's a thing also, like I could speak for alcoholism. Uh, only another alcoholic can understand what I went through and what I go through, uh, even after 36 years. Shit doesn't go away. Yeah, I'm still an alcoholic, I'm a recovering alcoholic. Um but I I I just think that um veterans also have this, and first responders have this, and I've heard it, and you've heard it a lot. Okay, I could talk to this therapist, they don't fucking get it. They don't fucking understand. You know, all I'm doing is venting. They don't get it because they're not a veteran, they didn't see action, they didn't suffer any type of trauma in the military. They never signed their name on the dotted line. And there's a fuck you attitude about that sometimes.

Speaker 1:00:12

100%. And I'm so glad that you brought that up, Scott, because uh I've recently uh partnered up and started collaborating with this huge company by the name of uh Psych Armor and uh their CEO, Tina. Uh they're really uh leading this, uh spearheading this great initiative where they're trying to bridge that exact gap where it's like some of these facilities they open up veteran programs, but they don't know what the veteran needs or how to properly communicate. So Tina and her team literally acclimates them and teaches them the cultural aspect of what our culture means, how to really actually connect on an emotional level, on a humanistic level, and train them, certify them that these are the do's and don'ts of how to approach certain conversations as it relates to therapy and most importantly our active duty and um uh veterans. So they certify those clinics to say, I have the green stamp that I do know how to communicate with them.

Scott McLean 1:01:07

And this sounds like she needs to be on the podcast.

Speaker 1:01:09

Oh, yeah, I'll let her know. I will let her know.

Scott McLean 1:01:11

I'd love to have a conversation with her about that. That would be a pretty blunt and open conversation, I'm sure.

Speaker 1:01:18

And she's amazing. I mean, she loves research. Yeah, every time we jump on a on a call, she talks about an article that she read, and she's very passionate. She comes with a military background, yeah, and the rest of the team does. So they're all passionate and they they understand.

Scott McLean 1:01:31

That's awesome. Um, I get a lot of people reach out to me. I'm not patting myself on the back, I'm not saying I have the greatest podcast ever. I just do what I do, I love what I do, it's therapeutic for me. Um, but I get people to call, and I've had people reach out from all around the country. I've interviewed people all around the country, and I have a uh a good amount that will reach out to me and they'll be like, hey, uh love your podcast, and da-da-da-da, and I'd love to come on your podcast. And I always do the pre-podcast interview, whether it's through an email,

Record Sharing Limits And Trust

Scott McLean 1:02:05

uh, what's your connection to veterans? And I figure it out real fast, and there's one thing I fucking hate. I fucking hate it. I don't answer them the way I want to answer them, but when they you know they're just doing it to be virtuous, but it really doesn't fucking mean anything to them. They just want publicity for what they do, and they try to squeeze the veteran aspect into it. You know? I got yeah, I'm I'm gonna come clean right now. I got caught once on an interview. Like I interviewed this person, and halfway through the interview, I was like, they're just they're not even talking about the veteran population, they're squeezing it in. They're just oh, and this goes for veterans too. As soon as I hear that, I'm like, oh, this isn't good. Like, she got me. She got me, right? So I have to finish the interview. But I would say, like, I want to know what the veteran, and she would just say, Oh he, I don't I don't want to put anything, I'm not doxing anybody. Uh they would do that. They'd be like, Oh, and and as far as the veterans go, we blah blah blah blah blah. I'm like, but that's you're not really differentiating, you're just including. Yeah, you're just sprinkling it. That episode got deleted. I published it for a little while. I was like, fuck that.

Speaker 1:03:23

But aren't you glad that that that that happened?

Scott McLean 1:03:26

Yeah, well, I I learned a big lesson from it. And it was early on in this in this podcast, yeah. One of the earlier episodes, and it showed me two things. Don't be hungry for content, the content will come.

Speaker 2 1:03:40

Yeah.

Scott McLean 1:03:41

And don't sell you, don't sell out, don't sell out you know, to somebody just because you want content. Yeah. You know, and I don't know if I did that. I I'd like to think I didn't, but I think I did. And that sucked.

Speaker 2 1:03:56

It's okay.

Scott McLean 1:03:56

It's a waste. No, I know. I learned a good lesson from it. So I kind of want to that's why I always want to know beforehand how is this relative to veterans? Yeah. I learned to ask that question because them virtuous fuckers. Yeah. They're just doing it just to get the, you know, I fucking hate that.

Speaker 1 1:04:11

No, and we're not going to be able to do that.

Scott McLean 1:04:12

I think I got my point across.

Speaker 1:04:14

Yeah, no, trust me. And I experience it all all the time with uh the same concept about, you know, software systems and veteran programs and stuff. It's like, well, I I want to get in network with them. I'm like, but what's the reason why you want to get in that? Is it is it because of the government contracting? Is it because you're gonna receive a check or or are you really seeing the pain points or disparities in our community? And if you're gonna help, sure, God will bless you with whatever we'll bless you with. But at the end of the day, if you're not in it with the right heart, I mean, just don't simple.

Scott McLean 1:04:47

Uh to use this as an opportunity.

Speaker 1:04:49

Exactly. And I hate that. Yeah.

Scott McLean 1:04:51

I it just Oh, we can make we can make money that way, or we'll just hey, how about if we just include veterans? And that's a whole new Yeah.

Speaker 1:04:59

There's a couple facilities up uh a little north. I think there's one in Georgia and one in Texas, where they're opening up health homes because they're quantifying veterans as like if I if I could get a certain amount of veterans in a bed and a room, and we could have two bunk beds and this and that, and that's what like heats me up. But I'm I'm at peace too, though, Scott. Yeah, yeah. I'm at peace because I know that since they're in it in that manner, it's only a matter of time before it crumbles. Yeah. Because we know how to sniff out the people that are in it for us and or not, and everything will follow. But it's its due time.

Scott McLean 1:05:36

I feel for for our people that get sucked into it too. Yeah. And they're just being, you know, they're not I don't think they're getting the the attention they think they're getting. It's just another body and another lane. Yeah. To use your term from earlier, that they can profit off of. Anyway.

Speaker 1 1:05:55

Yeah. I feel better. Yeah.

Scott McLean 1:05:57

See, this is good therapy right here. Absolutely.

Speaker 1 1:06:00

Thank you for the mic.

Scott McLean 1:06:02

Absolutely, my friend. This is great. Well, Freddie, my friend, I have a feeling that we will be uh we'll be friends for a long time to come. Absolutely. And again, I'll say this on air, off air. Anything you need, buddy, I I'll help you. I if I could help you, I would be more than glad to. Um, and I look forward to being on that panel. That's gonna be uh it's gonna be very good. I think there's something good is gonna come out of that. And I I look forward to you putting together more. And even though I'll be on one panel, but I would love in the future to just attend anything like that. So reach out and let me know, and I'd love to show up because I want to learn too.

Speaker 1:06:41

Yeah, no, I appreciate you, Scott, so much. And uh all the veterans that I know and the people that I represent, thank you. Yeah, thank you for what you're doing because it's not easy waking up every morning and doing what you do, and then being on that side of the mic, asking the tough questions. Yeah, uh, my hands are sweating by the way, audience. Um, and being able to just have that open spirit, that welcoming

PTSD Awareness Panel And Community Goals

Speaker 1:07:05

spirit, allowing us to have that platform to talk. So thank you. And then anybody that wants to reach out or want to partake, they could feel free to reach out to me. My email is Freddie at sunwavehealth.com. And any ideas or anything that you guys need for our community, let me know. And I only do one thing, I show up.

Scott McLean 1:07:23

And it's Freddie F R E D D Y or one D or two Ds?

Speaker 1:07:28

Great question. I don't know why I didn't do that. Yes, it's it's Freddie the non-traditional way. F-R-E-D-Y at Sunwave Health.com.

Scott McLean 1:07:36

I have a I have two friends named Todd. One does one D, one does two D's. Yeah. They they'll both say that their way is right.

Speaker 1:07:43

Yeah, and I'll probably give you one golden nugget. I actually intentionally misspell my name on LinkedIn. Yes. To avoid spam. You told me that. So if you try to look me on LinkedIn, it's gonna be F-R-E-D-Y-E. Mendes.

Scott McLean 1:07:57

Yeah.

Speaker 3 1:07:58

Yeah.

Scott McLean 1:07:58

And thanks to our friend Tim Roberto.

Speaker 1:08:00

Yes, absolutely. Shout out to Tim. Tim, and he's having it at Beachway Therapy Center. So uh we're blessed to have them uh sponsor us, co-sponsor us for this unique event. Uh they're allowing us to use their facility and set the panel. And Tim, he's a superhero, and I'm not saying that because he wears a cape all the time. He does, but he really is a superhero for all of us, and he's created this uh a beautiful community that it wouldn't be here if it wasn't for him.

Scott McLean 1:08:28

Yeah, and I met him through a friend of a mutual friend uh and me and me and Tim hit it off instantly. Oh, yeah, instantly. He's a great guy, yeah, down to earth, and he's hard to keep up, man. Yeah, he's hard to keep up with. Yeah, he's a bundle of energy, yeah. Oh, yeah. And he has his stomping out the stigma nonprofit, uh, which gives veterans and first responders uh 10 free sessions off the grid with a therapist, yeah, absolutely off the grid. Uh, and that goes for on duty uh or retired first responders or military. Yeah, you know, and Tim's doing great stuff, man. Great stuff. So all right, with that, let me do my outro and then we'll we'll talk afterwards. Uh well, we built another bridge today. This one was a tech bridge. This is my first tech bridge, but uh the goal why I say that at the end of every episode is we built the bridge because I think that these islands, we're all islands amongst ourselves. We really are in the nonprofit world and in the mental health world. And how do you get to another island other than a boat? You build a bridge. It's easier to get to. And that's why I say that that at the end, we built the bridge, and I want all these bridges to eventually connect to each other. And so today was my first tech bridge, and uh thanks again to Freddie for coming on. And well, like I always say, uh, you will see me and you will hear me next week.